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erasure4rum     Erasure Albums    The Innocents (1988)  ›  Vince Didn't Enjoy Making "THE INNOCENTS"...
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Vince Didn't Enjoy Making "THE INNOCENTS"...  This thread currently has 1,796 views. Print
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MikeyC
December 25, 2015, 9:02pm Report to Moderator

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Most of you who've been listening to "The 12 Days of Christmas" audio interviews with V & A probably heard this nugget of info when they were reminiscing about the first time an Erasure album went to Number One. And Vince said he was actually a bit disappointed in "The Innocents" hitting Number One since he didn't enjoy making the album and it wasn't a great time for him... Hmmmm...

Anybody have ideas why this was the case? The relationship with Hague, the producer? The writing process? Trouble in a personal relationship?

I think it would be fascinating to find out more!  
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Erasured
December 25, 2015, 9:27pm Report to Moderator

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Sounds very intriguing!
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Mikedepaz
December 26, 2015, 1:11am Report to Moderator

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If memory serves me right. It's been documented at the time that both Vince and Andy had a real tough working relationship with Stephen Hague and vowerd never to work with him again. Stephen had usually a my way or the highway mentality and clashed heavily with Vince working style.

I will say that if you look at Stephen body of work at the time, it's pretty impressive what he did with New Order, PSB and OMDto mention a few. the end product with The Innocents is nothing but stunning but How we got there is probably another story.Ido notice that Stephen did not work again with other artist on hit records leaving me to believe that he was also clashing with other groups too.


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Pughie
December 26, 2015, 10:38am Report to Moderator

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But funnily enough Stephen Hague did return to work on Andy's 2nd solo album,a project that when finished was never released as Daniel Miller said it sounded "too much like Erasure",so the project was scrapped and then Andy went on to record Non Stop with Pascal Gabriel.
The only track to make an appearance was Keep It to Yourself a highlight of the Non Stop box set.
If the rest of the album sounded like KITY then I'd love to hear it as that was poles apart from the mainly awful Non Stop album.


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Mikedepaz
December 27, 2015, 3:12pm Report to Moderator

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You are correct Mark. But at the time of the innocents, I think Andy was probably more frustrated that Vince was was frustrated at Stephen. He usually was reserve with his opinions.

I too would love to hear the original Non-stop, the Daniel approved one has been Non- Played since.


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MikeyC
December 29, 2015, 2:18am Report to Moderator

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Wasn't there also a strained working relationship with Martin Phillips on "Chorus"?  
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Mikedepaz
December 29, 2015, 4:40am Report to Moderator

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Quoted from MikeyC
Wasn't there also a strained working relationship with Martin Phillips on "Chorus"?  


Yup there was one with him as well.


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Hergallego
December 29, 2015, 5:20pm Report to Moderator

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The Innocents has terrific songs such as ALR, Chains, Ship of Fools or Phantom Bride but the rest (although I like) it isn't my piece of cake.
I prefer other albums and I think that the reason is beacause I can't feel a free Vince in it.
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Mikedepaz
December 29, 2015, 8:18pm Report to Moderator

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Quoted from Hergallego
The Innocents has terrific songs such as ALR, Chains, Ship of Fools or Phantom Bride but the rest (although I like) it isn't my piece of cake.
I prefer other albums and I think that the reason is beacause I can't feel a free Vince in it.


Stephen Hague has a different working style that clashed maybe with Vince. At the time of making the Innocents perhaps Vince might of felt restricted in what he wanted to sound. Stephen perhaps wanted to deal with a more polished sound as he had done with other groups at the time.


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dayalet
December 29, 2015, 10:08pm Report to Moderator
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It's the production that prevents The Innocents from being a favourite of mine.... it's just quite MOR sounding compared to most of their other albums in my opinion.

It's polished but it seems to lack any soul. And it's not the songs themselves which make me feel that way.

And while it does have perhaps strongers songs then Wild - I'd much rather listen to the latter because of it's non homogenous production sound
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MikeyC
December 30, 2015, 3:01am Report to Moderator

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It is somewhat of an "odd man out" album for them, in that it doesn't really have much of, if any of, that signature Vince "bleeps and bloops" sound. Even the first album, as "primitive" as it is, contains classic Vince elements. Regardless, this has turned into a fascinating discussion!  
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glazball
April 27, 2017, 7:25pm Report to Moderator
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Just caught up with this thread myself, and it's fascinating.  Especially since I just read Vince's quote that he enjoyed making WBG more than the nebulously-phrased "previous ones."

Mike, we need you to write An Unofficial History of Erasure because you know more about them than V&A themselves do!

Regarding Stephen Hague - he did seem to fall off the radar after the early 90s (I suppose you could say the same about Mark Saunders).  Though The Innocents does sound the least "Erasure-ish" of their earlier albums, I don't think it's a bad thing.  Somehow, in my mind, it seems like back then producers actually had a grand vision in mind and had the artists' best interests at heart, and that shows through in the final product.  Nowadays, that doesn't seem to hold true as often.  I know some of you hold Innocents as your favorite, some love other albums, but I don't think any Erasure fan thinks it sounds bad.  Different and perhaps more US radio-friendly due to Hague's production, but not bad.  Perhaps his influence and head-butting with Vince is why Wild! and Chorus sound the way they do??


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Mikedepaz
April 27, 2017, 11:18pm Report to Moderator

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Well I don't know about that but thanks for the praise. I personally liked all of Stephen Haugue projects he worked on from this period. He worked with a very diverse group of artist that I still love today

But in 32 years, I always felt that Erasure could do their magic on their own. We will soon see what it will sound like


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DaveKCMO
April 28, 2017, 1:23am Report to Moderator

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Hadn't they only worked with Flood prior to that?
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Mikedepaz
April 28, 2017, 2:44am Report to Moderator

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Quoted from DaveKCMO
Hadn't they only worked with Flood prior to that?


Yes, Flood did the first two and Daniel Miller chose Stephan Hague for the Innocents

He does have an impressive resume of some of my all time favorite albums by other artist:

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stephen_Hague


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erasure4rum     Erasure Albums    The Innocents (1988)  ›  Vince Didn't Enjoy Making "THE INNOCENTS"...

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